any updates on this?
maybe a next public beta?

i'm a bit tired about hoping for some new version or even VR to be implemented... a long, long time ago a VR capability was promised but never came true...

however... i'm glad with my empeg as it is... people can easily get used to circumstances...

cheers

I've been wondering the same thing for a while now but never had the guts to post the question here.

Since you have a Mk1 I assume you've been around for a while. Anyways the car product is EOL and the guys are working on projects that actually pay money. Since it does share code with other current (i.e. paying) projects we can hope they will appear in a future release of the RioCar software but when they get time. Remember they're probably using the software themselves so it is in their interest to code to some extent

Be patient and don't hassle the guys please... They're still here and they still provide us with tons of useful info to go off on our own hacking projects.

My 2c

Oh and ... "it's released when it's released" is the standard line around here if you haven't been reading.

The answer to this question is "when it's f***ing ready". We've done no work on the car player for over 5 months now. We're extremely busy at the moment, working on something entirely different. Once that's done, we'll have to work out what to do next.

Bearing in mind that the car player is EOL, it's never going to get any official time allotted, so it'll either have to be done when we get a spare moment, or piggy-backed onto another project, as was done with the Rio Central.

Now, personally speaking, I'd love to be able to give you a new release of the car player (and I'm sure that the rest of us would too), but it doesn't generate any revenue.

And if you take a close look at our share price, I'm sure you'll understand why the powers-that-be are nervous about things that don't generate any revenue.

So, to summarise:

1. We know you want a new release.
2. We want a new release.
3. We're busy. Bugging us won't make it happen any quicker.

What about Voice Recognition?!





just kidding


ms

Perhaps we could setup a empeg contract work fund and donate muchos dineros. It might be an incentive to the guys if they have any "spare" time to develop.

<cynical mode>
Perhaps it is time to be realistic... At 0.69$/share and with an EOL'd product (can the Central be far behind given this economy?!?) we're not likely to EVER see another Rio Car release from SBLU officially.

Selfishly(because I love techie gadgets), I hope SBLU comes out with the splashiest, sexiest, most awesome for your moniest, product ever and they become hugely sucessful.

But historically things do not look good.

I mean look at the latest release on their site:
- RioRiot (so far just a me-too in the category)
- Rio900 (OK, flash memory prices have fallen)
- RioVolt SP50C (a co-branded product ?!? right...)
- RioEX1000 (What were they thinking? GIVE US REPLAY RADIO at least)

I'm willing to be impressed... So bring it on!
</cynical mode>

Whew. Sorry about that. I know you guys in the UK are busting butt to deliver great stuff, I just wish you had more to work with. We will wait (our choice is...?) I'm sure glad we've got our empegs and the crew around here!

Tim E (time)

Spare time? Yeah right.

Hey,
I like the idea of setting up donations! that would be great.....would give ppl incentive to devleop stuff.

Just an idea, and it is unlikely that SBLU will agree to it, but what if we found one or two people that are willing to donate their time to the development of the empeg software for free. They would sign a contract with SBLU/empeg, which is basically an NDA that allows the person to enhance the current code base of the empeg car software and to release the binaries of this to the public.
Those people might get some donations from other empeg owners (such as free lenses, a free tuner module (built from GODs kits)), but absolutely no money from SBLU. On the other hand those people would not release any internals from the codebase (such as references to other projects) to anyone but the empeg employees.

This might be OK for SBLU even though chances are low. But if it were OK with them, we would get software releases more often.

There is another thing SBLU should think about: The empeg (and riocar) where always advertized with a set of tuner features that are still not supported in a stable software release. This really upsets quite a few customers who might think twice before buying another SBLU product which is advertised with "future" features, because those "future" features might as well be seen as imaginary features.

cu,
sven

In Antwort auf:

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And if you take a close look at our share price, I'm sure you'll understand why the powers-that-be are nervous about things that don't generate any revenue.

---

then they might be even more nervous about things that might cause lawsuits, bad press, and huge refunds.

bye,
[L]

Far as I know, you really don't have a course of action. Your purchase doesn't mean there is a contract for the guys to release regular updates to you. Your purchase is your purchase. They release updates to us because they can. There is no legal obligation on their part to put out more software for this product.

The worst thing that could happen is if emails such as yours were to send them over the edge and making them never return to this forum, and never release another update again.

As for refunds on an EOLed product ... I'm sure there's a deadline after your original purchase from which you can't get a refund ... better go to Ebay or the For Sale forum.

Greg

I don't believe your views are representative. I'm not aware of anyone asking for a refund, and many of our customers credit us with writing the most complete and functional in dash MP3 player that was ever sold.

Rob

I agree - pretty much everyone here thinks we already have a gizmo that is the dog's bollocks. The amount of effort that is put into an EOL'ed product by a number of individuals (some of whom are SB, some just enthusiastic users) who get no pay for this is amazing.

What is very cool is that we do still get releases from Rob and the SB guys at all. Now don't get me wrong, we are all straining at the bit waiting for New Toys(tm) but I feel there is no basis for complaining about what we currently have!

mankind is never satisfied with things they got. they always want more...

of course i'd like even more cool specials - though i'm very happy with my cool empeg and i'd never give it away and i hope it'll never break... i wouldn't know what to do without it in my car...
any other mp3-player for in-car-use is far away in quality, design and functionality from the mk2... well.. that's my opinion..

Don't you just hate it when people start talking about lawsuits.

I know people on this thread have given all the support that I've come to expect from the Empeg community, but I hope that you don't mind me adding my penny's worth.

Subjectively: If I never saw another update, I am just happy for the superb facility that the Empeg/Rio offers me to better enjoy the music that has been my chief hobby and interest in life.

Objectively: US law is not part of my remit, but I've been "down the corridor" and we don't think anyone has anything to lose any sleep over.

So, to quote every waiter in every restaurant these days, you've got your Empeg/Rio: "Enjoy".

Not to stir things up, BUT when I bought my player it was around the same time I read about the future of the RioCar player on the following site:

http://www.empeg.com/eol.html

Quote:

"All warranties and support will continue, as will the development of new software, which is important for SONICblue's goals of integrated products and its work with the automotive industry."

This was also around the same time the 2.0 Beta's were very actively developed leading one to think a 2.0 stable release could be expected. Based on what that website says I do understand how 'some' people could expect SBLU to follow through on their printed commitment regardless of where the stock price may be.

Now, with all this said I want to state that I am very happy with my player and if NO update would ever be released again I'd still remain satisfied with the best in-dash car mp3 palyer to date. I can happily live with the few remaining noticeable bugs i am encountering with the Beta11. However it would be nice if at some point we could get a stable 2.0 release

then they might be even more nervous about things that might cause lawsuits, bad press, and huge refunds.

ROTFLMAO!

Microsoft have promised a stable, secure and well supported OS just about every time they've released one and still haven't achieved it. And they make a huge profit. And have been shown to be acting as an illegal monopoly. But you still don't hear of people suing them for refunds.

Even *if* there was 1% of owners who are dissatisifed enough with their empegs to launch lawsuits, then that'd still only be about 50 people - which would hardly be news. And even if it was news, the only real net effect of it would probably be to raise awareness of the empeg amongst the public so that more people would see just how cool it is, and how pathetic the lawsuits were.

I for one don't remember seeing any promise (legally-binding or otherwise) to increase functionality after the sale. I think that the empeg guys do a great job with customer support, and are incredibly helpful to this community beyond that. For instance, answering tehnical questions that helped make third party hacks such as the Button LEDs and digital IO board a reality not a dream. Allowing the fascia CAD files to be used so that real Wood fascias could be made. Allowing Patrick to go ahead with the new tuner kit. I can't see Sony being anywhere near as helpful to the customers of their new unit.

Yeah, so SB has different priorities to Empeg Ltd. - and they are in business to make money. So it is understandable that they want to pay their staff to work on revenue-generating stuff. That's business. If I was the boss of SB, I'd be telling them to do the same.

So go ahead and sue if you must. You'll spend a lot more money than you did on your empegs, and we'll all get some free entertainment at your expense.

Not sure about a stable release but we'll most probably still get more beta releases. The empeg team have players themselves so they still have a motive for fixing bugs and adding features.

- Trevor

RE: Microsoft
But you still don't hear of people suing them for refunds.

Yep, this is unfortunate too, considering I still have a hard time buying a complete system without an MS OS being added to the sale. Last time I tried, I bought a $3000 laptop from Gateway, and didn't want Windows 98 on it. I gave up on ordering it without it, so I took delivery, never opened the OEM CD/Manual, and called Gateway. I asked for a refund as stated in the EULA. They bounced me back and forth so much I finally gave up and sold it at a local software store.

If I bought a new machine today, I'd be more willing to presue this, since OEM install disks from MS are now tied to that specific vendor. I own enough software licenses for MS software that I don't need more when I buy a new system. So in my case, it's not even an anti-MS OS stance, it's just the fact that I don't like paying for something I don't want. But the next complete system I plan on buying is a Mac, and I won't mind paying for a legitimate copy of OS X for the machine alongside the hardware.

They are developing new software... it's just not being released.

Ooh ooh and I'll go sue Pioneer and Sony for not being able to play Pac Man on their MP3 players...

How about releasing the current alpha version as the next beta?

On the European Empeg 2002 Meet, if I remember correctly, Rob said the current alpha could just as well be released as the next beta. The current alpha supposedly fixes some tuner/RDS problems, and probably some other stuff as well.

I'd really like to see these RDS fixes released. Right now, I have to choose between crashing the player (using the latest "stable" release) or not returning to the player after a TA.

The only effort needed to release the current alpha, Rob said, is writing release notes and stuff like that. Perhaps one of the alpha team members is willing to put up this task. Then the only effort for the Sonic Blue guys would be to put it on the website.

Pim

This was also around the same time the 2.0 Beta's were very actively developed leading one to think a 2.0 stable release could be expected.

The 2.0 betas were released well after the EOL announcement.

leading one to think a 2.0 stable release could be expected.

I have faith that the next 2.0 beta will probably be stable enough to consider a final release. Whether or not they name it "beta" or "final" is going to be a different story.

The 2.0 betas were released well after the EOL announcement.

Well the post announcing the first beta was on 18/10/2001 and the EOL announcement was on 24/9/2001, less than one month prior. The beta was obviously in active development even before the EOL announcement. So what is wrong with my statement that the EOL announcement was around the same time the Beta was actively being developed? Its a moot point anyway as thats not the point I was trying to make. The point was that the EOL announcement stated software would be continued to be developed as it would be in the best interest of SBLU yadda yadda yadda.

I have faith that the next 2.0 beta will probably be stable enough to consider a final release. Whether or not they name it "beta" or "final" is going to be a different story.

I have no doubt that the next release would probably be stable enough to consider final. Some companies release buggier software as final year round (microsoft anyone?). However, based on what some people have said in this thread.. it seems very unlikely to me this is happening anytime soon, if ever.

In any case, I made sure to state, even in my last post that in the end it all doesn't matter as I could happily live without any further upgrades and that I can live with the few remaining bugs and still be more than happy with my purchase.

This leads me to ask what about the "Wish List" forum? Everyone keeps wishing for more features yet its not even sure when or even if the current feature set will see a stable release.

This leads me to ask what about the "Wish List" forum? Everyone keeps wishing for more features yet its not even sure when or even if the current feature set will see a stable release.

We can dream.

This leads me to ask what about the "Wish List" forum? Everyone keeps wishing for more features yet its not even sure when or even if the current feature set will see a stable release.

People also throw pennies into a wishing well and wish for good fortune...

Its not the mp3 part that I'm talking about.

it's the non-functional RDS that really pisses me off.
Ever tried to drive a car in germany, especially the rhein-main-area, or northward on A7, without functioning TA on the car stereo?

bye,
[L]

In Antwort auf:

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of course i'd like even more cool specials

---

I dont want no 'cool specials'

I just want a working RDS system, as in any $50 crapshot stereo from walmart.

bye,
[L]

In Antwort auf:

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Far as I know, you really don't have a course of action. Your purchase doesn't mean there is a contract for the guys to release regular updates to you. Your purchase is your purchase.

---

not quite.
I ordered, and was sold, an empeg with functioning RDS system but i still have to get a player software which delivers me a functioning RDS system. IANAL, but IMHO that makes it a contract between me and Empeg Ltd which has not been fulfilled until I get a working RDS.


just to make it clear:
I dont want no new features or extra gimmicks.

All I want is this:

• the empeg should be able to switch AF frequencies in a decent manner, not 5 minutes after the current frequency has become unuseable
• it should go back to player mode when it had been there before a traffic announcement
  

and given some of the posts of some SBers in the bug formus regarding my concers with RDS, I have been promised that those little RDS features (which any $50 walmart stereo can handle) should be resolved 'in the next release', so I ask 'when?'

bye,
[L]

Lemmy,,

I just want a working RDS system, as in any $50 crapshot stereo from walmart.

I don't think youre gonna find that you get what you "WANT" by threatening others with lawsuits or even mentioning them in the way you did.

And even though I agree with some of what you have to say.. I despise the way you present it. You dont even realize that by presenting it in such an aggressive manner you only get people pissed off at you. How do you think that is gonna help any?

The empeg guys seem very busy, i'm 100% sure that in good time we will get many more upgrades. Just remember that these decks are one of a kind, and are priceless. All the empeg guys have these decks in their car, and i'm sure they will be making many upgrades. If RDS is 100% needed, just go and get the $50 walmart deck and use that. Bugging and threating the empeg gods will not get features added in a timely manner.

and given some of the posts of some SBers in the bug formus regarding my concers with RDS, I have been promised that those little RDS features

AFAIK, the SB ppl still don't post here in their official capacity whatsoever. I'd strongly urge you to read this post and at the same time consider what this community would lose if the SB people decided to withdraw their participation here for fear of litigation (no matter how slight the threat may appear to them).

I don't want to play down the significance of your RDS frustration but to quote tgnb from a little further up this thread:

I despise the way you present it. You dont even realize that by presenting it in such an aggressive manner you only get people pissed off at you.

Erm, I don't know if it is just me, but my TA works almost perfectly. Yah, I sometimes have to double tap my knob (FNARRRR sorry, couldn't resist) to change source back to player, but hey ho - I can cope with moving my hand occasionally.

despise what you want, but I bought the Mk2 in the good faith that I'd get a better FM tuner than the one in the Mk1.
Even though the overall FM reception has improved, the mentioned RDS issues do really piss me off. And here in germany, ANY traffic station uses RDS, and the frequencies change every 20 miles...

Do try it, drive down the A7 during rush our, then realize that you didn't get any TA for the last hour, because the empeg fails to follow the frequencies during mp3 mode, then have a nice day in a traffic jam.

bye,
[L]

If only that were the problem, I could live with it...

the main issue is that the (my?) empeg does not follow the AF frequencies while in mp3 mode, and follows them in a very crappy way while in fm mode.


bye,
[L]

Your name isn't Derek, is it?

In reply to:

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...we're not likely to EVER see another Rio Car release from SBLU officially.

---

Well, paint me red and shut my mouth. I gladly stand corrected. Thanks Guys!
-Tim E

In reply to:

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Just an idea, and it is unlikely that SBLU will agree to it, but what if we found one or two people that are willing to donate their time to the development of the empeg software for free. They would sign a contract with SBLU/empeg, which is basically an NDA that allows the person to enhance the current code base of the empeg car software and to release the binaries of this to the public.

---

I agree it's unlikely, but just in case this is ever considered seriously, I hereby agree to volunteer some of my Copious Free Time to this purpose. I might balk if it means missing a climbing trip, though...

In Antwort auf:

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Now, personally speaking, I'd love to be able to give you a new release of the car player (and I'm sure that the rest of us would too), but it doesn't generate any revenue.

And if you take a close look at our share price, I'm sure you'll understand why the powers-that-be are nervous about things that don't generate any revenue.

---

in response to that: http://www.heise.de/newsticker/data/tol-01.08.02-001/ (in german, babelfish is your friend)


bye,
[L]

English speaking BBS members may prefer http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/020731/310390_1.html

Rob