#287390 - 30/09/2006 18:21
Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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After reading all the threads, I'm still confused. I have a lot of FIDS, so I THINK I'd benefit from this - especially if I knew what it did. Do I need it?
- Thanx
- Jon
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#287391 - 30/09/2006 18:35
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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enthusiast
Registered: 11/06/2003
Posts: 384
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#287392 - 30/09/2006 18:42
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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There is a maximum number of FIDs that the empeg can handle at one time, about 21000. Each playlist and each track take up one FID. If you try to play a playlist that contains too many FIDs, it won't be able to store them properly, and it will forget what it's been playing when you reboot.
The maximum number of FIDs is determined by the size of a part of your hard drive. This part was allocated at the factory, or the last time you ran the "drive builder" image, if you ever did. The thing is, when it was allocated, it requested 16MB (that might not be the right size, but it's irrelevant). But the way hard drives work, they have to allocate space in chunks of particular sizes. If your particular hard drive allocates in 16MB chunks, then it allocated exactly 16MB. If it allocates in 8MB chunks, you got exactly 16MB. But if it allocates in 32MB chunks, then you got 32MB. Or if it allocates in 10MB chunks, you got 20MB. The problem is that the software thinks that you have 16MB, regardless of how much space is actually there. The maxfid patch checks to see how much space is actually available, and modifies the software so that it will use all of it.
So, if you ever have problems where you play a large playlist and the empeg forgets about it when it restarts, then you have a problem that might be fixed by the maxfid patch. If you don't have that problem, then it's not going to do anything for you. But it shouldn't hurt anything either.
_________________________
Bitt Faulk
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#287393 - 30/09/2006 18:44
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 15/08/2000
Posts: 4859
Loc: New Jersey, USA
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Basically, the original player application was hard coded with specific limits in mind. No one ever expected (or planned for) multiple 100+ GB drives in the empeg when it was first delivered. Remember - the design was based on 10Mbps, USB1.0, 16MB RAM and the largest shipping drive combination was 60GB (dual 30GBs). This hard coded limit was based on the design of the player application - using a "scratch partition" of a specific size (I am too lazy to look it up right now), and using each sector in that scratch partition to directly map to a specific FID. So, now that larger drives and larger collections are available, people are starting to hit that upper bound. They have too much music on the player... In most cases, this does not really hurt anything. The dynamic partition data is out of range and requests to read or write to it error out. The player software does not mind and goes about its business. The only time this really becomes annoying is when you try to sync. (At least, this is where I personally first noticed it.) Because the FID is out of bounds, emplode would crash on each sync. But the player software would successfully rebuild the databases, so things were okay. With Roger publishing upgraded, manual steps for doing a disk build, and for Mark putting an updated builder together supporting large drives, the dynamic partition size is not a problem anymore. But the limit is still hard coded in the player application (2.0, 2.01, 3.0a11, etc.). Maxfid.v7 basically edits the binary of the player application, changing the hard coded limit to a new value. This value is calculated by the maxfid.v7 program. Basically, that's it. Maxfid.v7 does a poke/zap/bit-edit of the application binary to change the hard coded number to something a bit more large disk friendly. That is why it needs to be done with each player installation but not with each hijack update - you are physically editing the player binary file. Does that help? 
_________________________
Paul Grzelak
200GB with 48MB RAM, Illuminated Buttons and Digital Outputs
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#287394 - 30/09/2006 18:45
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: wfaulk]
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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Excellent. My empeg is forgetting my playlist upon rebooting, so this is probably the issue.
Thanks for the help!
- Jon
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#287395 - 30/09/2006 18:48
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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Only if the playlist is very large. If it's just one album or something, then there are other culprits.
_________________________
Bitt Faulk
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#287396 - 30/09/2006 18:54
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: wfaulk]
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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Quote:
Only if the playlist is very large. If it's just one album or something, then there are other culprits.
I generally do the "randomize everything" deal-e-o, so it's definitely a large playlist...
- Thanx
- Jon
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#287397 - 01/10/2006 15:21
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31600
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
so it's definitely a large playlist...
Yeah, but it would have to be more than a 21,000-song playlist in order to run into this problem. Is it that many songs?
If not, there are other things that might cause the problem that we'd need to work on.
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#287398 - 01/10/2006 21:21
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tfabris]
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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Quote:
Quote:
so it's definitely a large playlist...
Yeah, but it would have to be more than a 21,000-song playlist in order to run into this problem. Is it that many songs?
If not, there are other things that might cause the problem that we'd need to work on.
21,903 to be exact...
- Jon
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#287399 - 01/10/2006 21:37
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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This look right?
empeg:/empeg/bin# ./250635-set_empeg_max_fid.v7
250635-set_empeg_max_fid.v7: version 7 by Mark Lord (March 2005)
/dev/hda3: 48194 sectors
New max_fid value will be 44098 (0000ac42)
before:
00112888: 00000000 00000200 00000200 00000200
00112898: 00000400 00000200 00000600 00000200
001128a8: 00000800 00000010 00000810 00000010
001128b8: 00001000 00007000 00000000 00000000
after:
00112888: 00000000 00000400 00000400 00000400
00112898: 00000880 000003c0 00000c40 000003c0
001128a8: 00000800 00000010 00000810 00000010
001128b8: 00001000 0000ac42 00000000 00000000
empeg:/empeg/bin#
- Jon
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#287401 - 02/10/2006 16:22
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 09/08/2000
Posts: 2091
Loc: Edinburgh, Scotland
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SE_Sport_driver:
heh heh - decrease boot time
_________________________
Rory
MkIIa, blue lit buttons, memory upgrade, 1Tb in Subaru Forester STi
MkII, 240Gb in Mark Lord dock
MkII, 80Gb SSD in dock
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#287402 - 02/10/2006 21:52
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/07/1999
Posts: 5549
Loc: Ajijic, Mexico
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Quote:
While you're at it, use Mark's "fidsift" to sort your fids into folders
Can you elaborate on this? What does it do, how does it do it, and how do I go about obtaining/installing it?
tanstaafl.
_________________________
"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"
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#287403 - 02/10/2006 22:24
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tanstaafl.]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14496
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
Quote:
While you're at it, use Mark's "fidsift" to sort your fids into folders
Can you elaborate on this? What does it do, how does it do it, and how do I go about obtaining/installing it?
tanstaafl.
This one is more intrusive than the max fids thing. It is easier to use, but may slightly complicate your life next time you add more tunes to the player using v2 software.
It splits the massive /drive0/fids (and /drive1/fids if there's a second drive) directories into lots of much smaller subdirectories. This greatly improves filesystem efficiency on the player, but this really only affects database rebuilds.
It *does* speed up database rebuilds by quite a lot.
The problem with it, is that some versions of the player s/w (dunno which) sometimes download tunes to the original BIG directory, rather than to the appropriate subdir. I think this may be just a JEmplode issue, actually, but it's been over a year since I last peeked at it. Regardless, the sensible thing is to simply rerun it (fidsift.sh) after any new music dowloads.
Cheers
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#287404 - 02/10/2006 22:29
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: mlord]
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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Quote:
The problem with it, is that some versions of the player s/w (dunno which) sometimes download tunes to the original BIG directory, rather than to the appropriate subdir. I think this may be just a JEmplode issue, actually, but it's been over a year since I last peeked at it. Regardless, the sensible thing is to simply rerun it (fidsift.sh) after any new music dowloads.
Cheers
Hm. If I ONLY use emplode to upload files, would I still run into that problem?
I'm having an emplode problem now, and I want to get that fixed before I screw with the database. The problem will be posted on another thread...
- Jon
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#287405 - 02/10/2006 23:15
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: mlord]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/07/1999
Posts: 5549
Loc: Ajijic, Mexico
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Regardless, the sensible thing is to simply rerun it (fidsift.sh) after any new music dowloads.O-kayyy... 1) Where do I get it? 2) How do I install it? 3) Or if it isn't installed, but just "run", how do I run it? Please assume that I once overheard the word "Linux" in a conversation between a couple of geeks, and that is my total knowledge of the subject. tanstaafl.
_________________________
"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"
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#287406 - 03/10/2006 01:35
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tanstaafl.]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
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Basically, you use either hyperterminal or ftp to transfer the fidsift file to your empeg. Then, you "run" it while connected via hyperterminal. Never running it again will not hurt anything, but you'll slowly lose the benefit of having run it. From what I remember, emplode was actually designed with "sifted fids" in mind, but the empeg guys never actually turned the feature on in the player. Mark found a bug with it, but Hijack took care of it. So.... emplode actually works with it just fine and will continue to put the fids in the correct subfolder. If for some reason you do need to run it again, you just connect via Hyperterminal and type the command again... It'd be just like doing it the first time but it'll run much quicker. In my test, database rebuilds went from 17 minutes to 8! And copying fids while doing a hard drive upgrade went way faster too. (I think I was mistaken about boot times). Original Thread on Fidsift.sh - Give it a read.
Edited by SE_Sport_Driver (03/10/2006 01:46)
_________________________
Brad B.
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#287407 - 03/10/2006 06:48
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31600
Loc: Seattle, WA
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I seem to recall that some people, using certain third-party software for the empeg, ran into problems where the software didn't expect the sifted fids, and thus didn't work on a fidsifted player. I don't remember which programs, though (can anyone elaborate?). They might not matter to Doug, though, who pretty much just uses his player to play MP3s (the luddite! ).
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#287408 - 03/10/2006 07:54
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 15/08/2000
Posts: 4859
Loc: New Jersey, USA
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mirrordb is one of the programs that does not expect sifted fids. I never did get around to dealing with that. Pros - faster database building Cons - need to rerun the program when new files are uploaded, very few programs do not like it Doug, to run it you would do something very similar to the following: q #exit to shell rw #read/write root filesystem rwm #read/write music filesystems cd /empeg/bin #go to a known directory #upload 182190-fidsift.sh using hyperterm mv 182190-fidsift.sh fidsift.sh #renaming it to something more convenient chmod 755 fidsift.sh #makes it executable ./fidsift.sh #runs it, making lots of subdirectories and moving the files on your music filesystems. rom #read only music filesystems ro #read only root exit #exit shell, restart player #reboot and sync to test
_________________________
Paul Grzelak
200GB with 48MB RAM, Illuminated Buttons and Digital Outputs
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#287409 - 03/10/2006 12:57
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: pgrzelak]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
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I'm following along with these threads and am, too, a complete beginner with unix commands in Hyperterm. I very much appreciate the pixel by pixel explanation (much smaller increments than steps, eh?) you give, Paul! This line has me stumped- Quote:
#upload 182190-fidsift.sh using hyperterm
How does one upload using hyperterm? I don't suppose I could drag and drop... 
For some of us these 'simple' transactions (move file, run file) are a whole new world.
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)
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#287410 - 03/10/2006 14:24
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: Robotic]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31600
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
How does one upload using hyperterm?
Like this.
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#287411 - 03/10/2006 14:40
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tfabris]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
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Quote:
Quote:
How does one upload using hyperterm?
Like this.
Thanks, Tony! I'll have to digest that in quiet at home and with all of the puzzle pieces in front of me.
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)
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#287412 - 03/10/2006 14:46
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: Robotic]
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
How does one upload using hyperterm?
Like this.
Thanks, Tony! I'll have to digest that in quiet at home and with all of the puzzle pieces in front of me.
You know, when it came time to upload the file, I initiated a transfer using "Zmodem with Crash Recovery" with Hyperterminal and it uploaded just fine...
- Jon
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#287413 - 03/10/2006 14:55
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31600
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
You know, when it came time to upload the file, I initiated a transfer using "Zmodem with Crash Recovery" with Hyperterminal and it uploaded just fine...
You didn't need to say RZ at the shell prompt?
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#287414 - 03/10/2006 14:56
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tfabris]
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veteran
Registered: 08/05/2000
Posts: 1429
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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Quote:
Quote:
You know, when it came time to upload the file, I initiated a transfer using "Zmodem with Crash Recovery" with Hyperterminal and it uploaded just fine...
You didn't need to say RZ at the shell prompt?
Nope, just started the transfer and when it completed, I looked at the directory, and it was in there, I did the chmod, and executed the file. Easy peezy Japanesee.
- Jon
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#287415 - 03/10/2006 15:01
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31600
Loc: Seattle, WA
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hm. Anyone know if that's a normal feature of the shell prompt on linux systems? Cuz I was taught a long time ago that you had to tell the shell to start receipt of the file.
Or is it that hyperterminal sends the sz command for you if you haven't typed it yourself?
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#287416 - 03/10/2006 15:12
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14496
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
Or is it that hyperterminal sends the sz command for you if you haven't typed it yourself?
Must be. Most sane comms programs do something like that, though it is suprising to think that HT would do it.
Cheers
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#287417 - 03/10/2006 15:16
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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From the rz man page: Quote:
Normally, the "rz" command is automatically issued by the calling ZMODEM program, but some defective ZMODEM implementations may require starting rz the old fashioned way.
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#287418 - 03/10/2006 15:26
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31600
Loc: Seattle, WA
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#287419 - 03/10/2006 16:17
Re: Plain english description of what the "maxfid" patch does?
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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From the ZMODEM spec: Quote:
The sending program may send the string "rz\r" to invoke the receiving program from a possible command mode. The "rz" followed by carriage return activates a ZMODEM receive program or command if it were not already active.
In my experience, most do.
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Bitt Faulk
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j/k, looks good to go! Did you test it out yet?
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