How are folks from Cambridge (or heck, any of England) getting to Amersfoort?

Are you driving and taking a ferry? Chunnel? Flying? Swimming?

If anyone is doing some variation of driving, has anyone got room for Me, Jenny, and Rachel to bum a ride?

Our tentative plan is to fly into London during the week before, spend a day or two there, head out to Cambridge to see the flat at some point, and then head to Amersfoort. I've got the travel agent working on Cambridge->Amersfoort options now, but it would be really cool if we could just bum a ride and tell the travel agent not to worry about it.

After the meet, then we'll do Germany the following week.

Oh, and the travel agent is quoting me some pretty stiff rail fares just to get from London to Cambridge. If anyone wants to come pick us up at the hotel in London at some point, we'd love that, too.

Hey Tony!

When are you flying in (Heathrow?)?

Sounds like we may have similar front-end itinaries!!

I have to make my way up to Cambridge on the Saturday, to hitch up with Toby S. for some rock-climbing or whatever.

Cheers

When are you going up to Cambridge, and from where in London? I'm driving up from down south, then getting a lift with empeg people, and could probably fit in three people assuming there wasn't too much luggage.

pca

pretty stiff rail fares just to get from London to Cambridge

Fares from London to Cambridge should be about £20/person (return), so slightly less (not half) for a single. Prices vary according to the time of day that you're travelling, which direction you're travelling in (if you buy the tickets in Cambridge, they're slightly cheaper, even for returns), and whether you want London Underground travel on the rail ticket.

What were you quoted?

Mark and Patrick,

When are you going up to Cambridge, and from where in London?

"When" is open to your suggestion, and I don't know exactly where in London yet.

Here's the tentative plan. It's not set in stone yet, and is subject to change, especially if changing it would make it easier for us to bum a ride or two.

- Arrive at London/Gatwick the morning of Wednesday July 2nd.

- Spend the 2nd and the 3rd in London. Stay at the hotel two nights (I don't know which hotel yet), the nights of the 2nd and the 3rd.

- The morning of Friday the 4th, hopefully check out of the hotel and get picked up by someone going to Cambridge.

- Spend a little time seeing the offices there and meeting everyone before we all head over to Amersfoort.

assuming there wasn't too much luggage.

We're hoping to keep the luggage for this trip light. We want to have only three rolling suitcases (one for each of us), partly because we've had bad experiences with lost checked baggage on connecting flights and want to do only carry-ons, and partly because we know that it'll be easier to bum rides if we don't have huge amounts of luggage.

Fares from London to Cambridge should be about £20/person (return), so slightly less (not half) for a single. (...) What were you quoted?

The quotes are in USD, and I'll give totals because this includes all three of us (me, Jenny, Rachel).

"Heathrow express"... $87.00. I'm not sure what this is. I assume this is getting from the airport to our hotel or something. I dunno, I have to ask the agent.

"Britrail Days Out Pass 2 days within 8 days"... $209.00. I believe what the agent did is quoted some kind of a bulk pass on the rail system that we could use any time, rather than just a one-way point-to-point ticket to Cambridge. I think it's because she wasn't certain when exactly we were going to Cambridge.

"Eurail Selectpass 5 days within 2 months"... $760.00. I think this might be a similar thing to get us between Amersfoort and Germany, and within Germany for the week we'll be there.

I think most of the above is probably not needed, and there's easier and cheaper ways to get between our destinations...

"Heathrow express"... $87.00. I'm not sure what this is. I assume this is getting from the airport to our hotel or something. I dunno, I have to ask the agent.

The Heathrow Express runs from Heathrow airport to Paddington Station in central London. Tickets cost £13 each one-way. If your hotel is near a Tube (underground) station, then it's easiest to get there by Tube. Otherwise, you might as well get a taxi from Paddington.

You can alternatively get from Heathrow to the centre more cheaply on Tube alone, but it's a much longer, noisier journey (60 minutes not 15).

On the other hand, your other post says you fly in to Gatwick, London's other airport. Which is it? Plenty of trains run from Gatwick into London (to Victoria or King's Cross Thameslink stations), for about the same price. (Except, by the sound of things, between about 0130 and 0530). The "Gatwick Express" is non-stop to Victoria, but it's probably more expensive than normal train services and not a huge amount faster. Again, once at any main London railway station, getting to anywhere else in London is dead easy on the Tube.

"Britrail Days Out Pass 2 days within 8 days"... $209.00. I believe what the agent did is quoted some kind of a bulk pass on the rail system that we could use any time, rather than just a one-way point-to-point ticket to Cambridge. I think it's because she wasn't certain when exactly we were going to Cambridge.

Sounds that way. Considering that, by the time you get here, you will in fact know exactly what you're doing, it should be way cheaper to get the exact tickets, even if you buy them at the station on the day. Trains from London to Cambridge leave from King's Cross station, which once more you can get to from anywhere else by Tube.

"Eurail Selectpass 5 days within 2 months"... $760.00. I think this might be a similar thing to get us between Amersfoort and Germany, and within Germany for the week we'll be there.

I don't know anything about Europe rail travel. Rob?

Peter

On the other hand, your other post says you fly in to Gatwick, London's other airport.

That's a very good question. If the travel agent knew we were flying into Gatwick, why would she look up train fares from Heathrow? I'm going to corner her on that. Thanks for pointing it out.

You can alternatively get from Heathrow to the centre more cheaply on Tube alone, but it's a much longer, noisier journey (60 minutes not 15).

Thanks for pointing this out. I think a short ride to the hotel is much preferred.

Thanks, also, for the link to TheTube.com. I anticipate we're going to be using it to get around while we're in London.

After the meet, then we'll do Germany the following week.

I don't know if you've been to Germany before, but if you get to Munich, you have to go to the Deutsches Museum

The absolute coolest museum that I have ever been to. Give yourself at least full day to go through it.

edit: just thought that I would tell you that I was freekin' blown away by the Bridge Building exhibit . The models of the bridges are amazing.

Thanks, we'll definitely take that into account when deciding what to do. We're also told that a boat trip up the Rhine is great, too. I wanna see some real castles.

See if you can get tickets for the London Eye while you’re around London. Its well worth the money, I think it’s the highest thing in London, and you can see the whole city, and surrounding country. Plus I’m sure your daughter would love it

Cool, thanks!

the highest thing in London

According to the rather twee "in-flight entertainment" video on the Heathrow Express last weekend, it's the fourth highest thing in London after the first Canary Wharf tower, the Post Office tower, and Tower 22 (where's that?). And I think that was before the subsequent towers were built at Canary Wharf. But none of those objects are frickin' gigantic Ferris wheels, so the Eye is still very cool.

Peter

Tower 22

That is the one that used to be called the Natwest tower.

So Patrick, thanks for offering the ride! I haven't heard back from you though... Is Friday morning OK or should we change our plans?

Also, I still haven't heard how most of the Cambridge people are traveling to Amersfoort. I don't know how you guys usually do it?

Our travel agent tells us that the Chunnel is trains-only, not cars. Is that true? I could have sworn that some people said they were driving to Amersfoort, so I have to assume that there's a way to get there by car. Is there a ferry, and if so, what are the departure and arrival points?

If we're all by ourselves, we'd like to avoid France if possible. I don't savor the idea of changing trains in France after going through the Chunnel. But if we were traveling with someone who's done it before, then it wouldn't be a problem.

I can't speak to anyone's specific plans, but....

Our travel agent tells us that the Chunnel is trains-only,

Other trains use the Eurotunnel/Chunnel including car-carrying shuttle trains. Your agent may have formed an opinion based on what they are able to book.

... Is there a ferry, and if so, what are the departure and arrival points?

This booking site has a nice drop-down list of ferry routes... No idea about their other qualities as I've never used them. I *do* vote for a nice slow ferry crossing at least once. Summer time, shouldn't be too rocky, not really that slow (1.5 hours Dover Calais, IIRC)

If we're all by ourselves, we'd like to avoid France if possible. I don't savor the idea of changing trains in France after going through the Chunnel. But if we were traveling with someone who's done it before, then it wouldn't be a problem.

Trying to avoid the occasional French strike, are we?? Well, FWIW, you could get to Amersfoort from London by train without putting your foot on French soil, but you'd still have to see a small bit of French territory. You can get a Eurostar from London/Waterloo to Brussels, then change to the Thalys to Amsterdam/Schilpol, then change to Amersfoort.

The Bahn's schedule site will let you look at your options (but won't give pricing for many cross-system bookings).

From a cost perspective, you are in a tougher spot since British Rail isn't an option in many (all?) of the multi-country rail passes, so the idea of getting a 3-country "select" pass is less useful if your itinerary plan is UK/Netherlands/Germany.

My memory is that Eurostar tickets were extra-expensive when I booked them on day of departure, and, if your schedule firms up, you might save a bit by booking before you leave. If your agent doesn't seem up to speed on rail ticketing, I can say that I gave had decent experience with Rail Europe over the phone for complicated tickets. The Rick Steves site also showed some sorts of sales omnpasses, so you might take a gander there.

Do I take it you might think about getting a car and driving from England? (just wondering about dragging a RHD car around in LHD countries and whether an agency would even let you drop it without charging big bucks...)

Thanks, Jim. That was a very informative post. I'm printing it to have with me the next time I talk to the travel agent.

Also, I still haven't heard how most of the Cambridge people are traveling to Amersfoort. I don't know how you guys usually do it?

Planet Empeg will be driving from Cambridge to Harwich (about 70 miles), getting the fast (3.5h) ferry to Hook of Holland, and driving from Hook (Hoek) to Amersfoort (70 more miles). I'm not sure who from Empeg is driving -- I've not been following the discussions as I can't make it this year.

Because Cambridge to Harwich is transverse, and all the railways in these parts run radial from London, it's virtually as hard to get to Harwich by train as it is to get to Amersfoort itself via Calais. Or you could fly Stansted-Amsterdam, but all in all your best bet, as you said from the word go, is "A Lift from Cambridge to Amersfoort".

Peter

As far as I know, all the empeg'ers are coming by car, on the Harwich - Hoek van Holland High speed catermeran (excellent boat - 4 Jumbo jet engines!!).

The Chunnel is all trains, but the trains carry cars/trucks, or carry express passenger trains. The freight trains are seperate from passenger. If you want to catch the car train, you drive from London to Folkstone, then drive onto the train with your car, wait 30 mins, and drive off into France on the other side. You then have a 3.5 hour drive at reasonable speeds to get to Amersfoort. If you want to do this, mail me for instructions on the route. This is not a cheap option as you'd have to hire a car for European travel - not cheap. In fact, b***** expensive.

If you want to get a foot passenger train, then you will need to get a Eurostar express from Waterloo in London. This gets you to Brussels in Belgium (2.5 hours), where you then have to change onto a NS International train to get to Amsterdam via Rotterdam (about 5 hours). Although this is a pretty good, comfortable journey, it is a LONG one. You would still have to get a train to Amersfoort from Amsterdam. If you are based in London, then I would suggest buying a set of Underground (Tube) travel passes for the time you are there, and use it in preference to taxis to reduce costs. It also allows you rapid travel between all the major railways stations to allow you to get out to Cambridge or Brussels.

I would avoid getting a Eurorail pass unless you specifically want to use the trains as your primary transport during the time you're over here. It's the sort of thing I'd buy if I wanted to spend about 2 months touring Europe by train, but to get here cheaply I would not bother booking tickets in advance, and simply book them when you arrive in the UK, or when you get to NL. This would be cheaper, and I've never had a problem getting tickets.

My feeling is, you should get the tube from your hotel on the Thursday, travel up to Cambridge on the train, stay over one night in a low-cost hotel, hitch a lift with the lads early Friday morning to Harwich and go with them on the Jet boat to NL. That way, you also get a chance to eat a green chicken Thai curry at the Wrestlers.

In about 2 years time, you'll be able to catch a direct train Waterloo - Amsterdam on the Eurostar or Thalys TGV trains, about 6 hours duration. Now THAT would be worth getting up early for.

You won't have time to travel to Cambridge on Friday morning, see the office and get to Harwich before the 10:40 AM boat. You will need to be in Harwich by around 9:30 AM, which means leaving Cambridge around 8 - 8:30 (rush hour). You will really need to be in Cambridge the night before, which means you will only be able to spend one+ day(s) in London. This ain't going to give you much time to see anything, so I would say you need to do some *serious* talking about what you want to see of London in one day - say two, or three major landmarks. Also, bear in mind travel times both around, and out of, London - you need to prepare beforehand to make sure you don't miss trains.

If you arrive on the red-eye at Gatwick, you will probably be able to get to London by about 10 AM. You will be jet lagged, I suspect, and then have to start sight-seeing with a tired little daughter in what will for you be the middle of the night. You will have Wednesday PM (Tower Hill/Tower of London/Tower Bridge???), Wed eve (West end Show, if you can get tickets - then you have to go and see Piccadily and Leicester square - eat at Wong Kei's (Wonkys) Chinese and enjoy wonderful food but the Worst Restaurant Service In The Known Universe), Thursday AM Houses of Parliament/London Eye/Thames Cruise and then around 2 PM you'd need to be heading North for Cambridge. Tight!

Err.... Mark, the event is on the Saturday....

Sorry to join this late - I haven't looked at the bbs over the weekend.
I'll be driving from Bedford via Cambridge on the Friday morning to catch the same HSS service as the empeg guys.

I can give you a lift from Cambridge or Harwich or you could even crash in Bedford on the Thursday night.

I'm not sure who from Empeg is driving

The reason that none of us have piped up with an offer of a lift is that we're not gonna have much (any?) room:

Hugo & Claire are going in Hugo's NSX (2 seater)
Rob's taking Mark in his Supra (2 seater, effectively)
I'm taking John G (and Patrick, IIRC) in my car, which _is_ 4 seater, but will already have 3 people in it.

And I think that that's about it.

There are other people coming over from the UK (e.g. Henrick), so you'll almost certainly be able to cadge a lift with them.

Sorry about ignoring you, I've just put in two 20-hour days in a row to finish a project before the deadline, and I didn't really have time to read the BBS

I'm going up to Cambridge sometime on the 3rd, as the ferry leaves early in the morning on the 4th. I can certainly swing through London on the way, although this would best be done either late in the evening or around mid-day, to avoid the rush-several-hours. My car isn't huge, but it's large enough to carry four people and a bag each, as well as the stuff I'm taking to Amersfoort. Assuming you can get a lift over to Holland with Henrick or someone else, there should be no problem.

If, on the other hand, no one has any room for everyone who wants to go, it would be possible to book a ticket and take my car over as well, which is what I was originally going to do before I was offered a lift. It would cost about £300, and we could split it I'd have to know soon though.

pca

I'm going up to Cambridge sometime on the 3rd, as the ferry leaves early in the morning on the 4th. I can certainly swing through London on the way, although this would best be done either late in the evening or around mid-day, to avoid the rush-several-hours. My car isn't huge, but it's large enough to carry four people and a bag each, as well as the stuff I'm taking to Amersfoort.

Thank you, Patrick! I will take you up on this offer. I realize now (from what everyone else just said) that my plan for going to Cambridge on Friday morning was foolhardy, and I agree that we should be going on Thursday night.

It's OK that we only get a day in London. Truth is that Jenny doesn't like big cities (we're hoping to book time in a much more rural part of Germany the following week) and will be pleased to know that we're spending one less day in London. It's a bit of a compromise... I want to see London and wouldn't mind a few days there, but Jenny would be happiest with zero days. So we're meeting in the middle.

Patrick, please PM me with your contact details so that I can call you when we're in London and we can coordinate where and when to meet for the ride. What I figure we'll do is leave our bags at the hotel desk after we check out Thursday morning, then go mess around the first part of the day Thursday. Then meet you back at the hotel, grab the bags, and catch the ride to Cambridge.

I'll be driving from Bedford via Cambridge on the Friday morning to catch the same HSS service as the empeg guys. I can give you a lift from Cambridge or Harwich ...

Deal! Thank you! I assume this means that you've got room for three others in your car, and that the car in question is riding the boat to Holland? In that case, we'll catch the ride from London to Cambridge with Patrick, and the ride from Cambridge to the ferry and Amersfoort with you.

If that's cool, please PM me with private contact details.

By the way, do the ferrys charge by person or by car? We'll pay our way whichever it is, but I was just curious.

Thanks again!

Rob, thanks very much for the detailed information about the ferry and about the travel timing. This helps immensely.

I agree that it doesn't give us much time to see London, and that we'll be jet lagged. But your suggestions are good ones. We probably won't be doing all that much in London, but I'll use your list as a guideline.

Thanks again, everyone, for all the great help and suggestions! Can't wait to meet everyone.

Tony,

Cambridge to Amersfoort is fine - bring an empeg if you want your own choice of music on the way!

The ferry fare is £13 each way per adult (children under four go free).

I'll PM you contact details.

bring an empeg if you want your own choice of music on the way!

Actually, this is an interesting dilemma.

I want to bring the empeg because it's an empeg meet, of course. But we want to travel extra light for this trip and every little bit counts. Plus, I don't want it to get lost or damaged in europe when it's going to spend most of its time packed away anyhow.

On trips where I'm not pressed for space, the empeg always comes along with the AC adapter and some pretty big self-powered speakers so I've got tunes in my hotel room. Not this time, those speakers are most of a suitcase on their own.

Thanks for the lift!