#175437 - 16/08/2003 10:53
More than two data streams from the same web site?
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31604
Loc: Seattle, WA
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I think this question may have been asked and answered here before, forgive me if this has been covered already.
In Internet Explorer, sometimes I attempt to download multiple files from the same web site. I can start two of them and get two download windows progressing. When I click on the third download, the site does not respond to it until the first file is finished downloading. This is a problem if the first two files are large. 
I can work around it by closing IE and starting a new session of IE in a fresh window. Then I can start the third download from that fresh window. In other words, I can get two streams per IE session, and then I have to start another session to get more.
Question: Is this a setting in IE, or is it a setting at the web site, and is there a way I can edit the registry to bump that number above two?
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#175438 - 16/08/2003 10:57
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
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The HTTP 1.1 RFC recommends that each client use only two connections per server. This is more of an "honor system" thing, web servers typically don't limit you from having more, but most "well behaved" clients have a limit of two per server.
IE's setting for this is in the registry. Go here for where you can change it.
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#175439 - 16/08/2003 11:04
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: tonyc]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31604
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Thanks for such a quick answer! That's exactly what I was looking for.
/me saves that bookmark so he can implement it on every system he comes in contact with.
I understand your point about the browser needing to be "well behaved", but I care only about its behavior towards me, not its behavior towards the server. And to have it freeze up and refuse to begin a download when I click on a link because of some arbitrarily low self-imposed traffic ceiling is something I would consider to be supremely ill-behaved.
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#175440 - 16/08/2003 11:09
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
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I understand your point about the browser needing to be "well behaved", but I care only about its behavior towards me, not its behavior towards the server. Server admins, of course, will have a slightly different point of view. But the way I look at it, if it was that important, it wouldn't be so easy to change. The way it is now is perfect -- you average Joe isn't going to be tying up more than 2 connections unnecessarily (with images, stylesheets, etc) but those who know where to go for the registry hack will get what they want. As the W32.Blaster worm shows us, a vast majority of people never change the default settings of the software they use.
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#175441 - 16/08/2003 11:18
Re: More than two data streams from the same web s
[Re: tfabris]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 20/01/2002
Posts: 2085
Loc: New Orleans, LA
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The previous thread was Here with a direct link to the knowledge base atricle here
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#175442 - 16/08/2003 12:09
Re: More than two data streams from the same web s
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14496
Loc: Canada
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There are also servers that implement download restrictions, but those are often based on source IP address and/or userid (if applicable), just to keep things sane when busy.
Cheers
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#175443 - 17/08/2003 02:51
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4181
Loc: Cambridge, England
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When I click on the third download, the site does not respond to it until the first file is finished downloading. This is a problem if the first two files are large. Well, whether it's a problem depends what the goal is -- in theory, if your goal is to finish all three downloads as soon as possible, it should be quicker to download them consecutively than concurrently, on the basis that, wherever the bottleneck is on your route to the origin server, the various TCP streams are going to be contending over it and not comparing notes. A smaller number (2) of TCP streams should in theory contend less and fill the pipe better. Now, I'm not saying this actually happens in practice -- but if it doesn't, it'd be interesting to know why not...
Peter
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#175445 - 17/08/2003 06:32
Re: More than two data streams from the same web s
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14496
Loc: Canada
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Bloody GUI's.
I usually use wget (command line) for multiple long "walk-away" downloads.
Cheers
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#175446 - 17/08/2003 06:35
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4181
Loc: Cambridge, England
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As with all big downloads, the goal is to get them all started and running, and then walk away from the computer. If I am unable to confirm the save location of the third download until the first is completed, then the two-connections limit becomes a problem. Doesn't IE start the download anyway (in background, to a temporary file)? ISTR doing this and coming back to a computer with half-a-dozen save boxes up, all of which completed instantly (the rename from temporary file to save location) once dismissed. OTOH I might be thinking of Galeon.
Peter
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#175447 - 17/08/2003 07:08
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: peter]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 21/07/1999
Posts: 1765
Loc: Brisbane, Queensland, Australi...
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No, IE forces two at a time and forced me to wait until the other one had finished before I could specify where to save the file. I think IE does download the qued files while you find the place to put it. But it puts its stuff in the temp dir until it's all in and then copies it across; infuriating if you have a big file as you have to wait for it to download and then copy.
I use opera's tranfer manager.
_________________________
--
Murray
I What part of 'no' don't you understand?
Is it the 'N', or the 'Zero'?
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#175448 - 17/08/2003 08:01
Re: More than two data streams from the same web s
[Re: peter]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 09/09/2000
Posts: 2303
Loc: Richmond, VA
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One case is when you have a very fast, but very high latency internet connection -- like my DirecWay sat connection ... In that case, when you look at a web page that has (for instance) a bunch of pictures, you want as much concurrent as possible because you take a 1-2 second hit on every connection.
I would tend to agree with you in the normal case from a purely performance standpoint... However, I do like > 2 concurrent downloads more out of convenience. It's nice to be able to kick a set of downloads from one place at the same time so you can go do something else (new empeg developer image, new emplode, new linux source). Otherwise you have to babysit the first two to start the 3rd.
ms
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#175449 - 17/08/2003 09:29
Re: More than two data streams from the same web s
[Re: mlord]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
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Only if they haven't done some wacky javascript thing to hide the link, or require a POST, or something.
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#175450 - 17/08/2003 13:11
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: muzza]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5683
Loc: London, UK
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forced me to wait until the other one had finished before I could specify where to save the file.
Peter's point is that it'll start downloading the third file to a temporary location, while it's prompting you for a filename. So you can walk away, and when you come back, it'll have several (more than two) location prompts on the screen, and they'll all complete immediately by copying the temporary file.
_________________________
-- roger
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#175451 - 18/08/2003 02:43
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: Roger]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 21/07/1999
Posts: 1765
Loc: Brisbane, Queensland, Australi...
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Yeah but it puts the file in a temp location, regardless of whether you've told it to save or not and then moves it there when the download is complete. Very annoying when you're sucking down Linux images at college onto your portable hard drive at college.  Very annoying.
Brought down the lab lab of 60+ computers once. Sys admin not too happy.
_________________________
--
Murray
I What part of 'no' don't you understand?
Is it the 'N', or the 'Zero'?
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#175452 - 18/08/2003 10:40
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: Roger]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 1866
Loc: Austin
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the problem lies in waiting for the save to dialog boxes to come up. if you wait too long itll time out.
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#175453 - 18/08/2003 12:58
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: RobotCaleb]
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enthusiast
Registered: 17/08/2000
Posts: 334
Loc: Seattle, WA. USA
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uh... why not use a download manager such as Get-Right or something? I use Get-Right in that fashion all the time... I can queue up a large number of files and set it to Automated Download. You can set the simultaneous download to two files and not anger the bandwidth lords...
_________________________
Brian H. Johnson
MK2 36GB Blue, currently on life support
"RIP RCR..."
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#175454 - 18/08/2003 15:46
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: bootsy]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31604
Loc: Seattle, WA
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why not use a download manager such as Get-Right or something? Sometimes GetRight doesn't work if they've done a lot of Javascript trickery to present you the file link. It's true that I swear by GetRight in most cases, though, I agree.
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#175455 - 19/08/2003 00:47
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: RobotCaleb]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5683
Loc: London, UK
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if you wait too long itll time out.
Never has for me.
_________________________
-- roger
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#175456 - 19/08/2003 16:32
Re: More than two data streams from the same web site?
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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I understand your point about the browser needing to be "well behaved", but I care only about its behavior towards me, not its behavior towards the server.
I'll keep my mouth shut about this after dealing with the server getting spikes of traffic throwing the load up over 150.
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