Just wondering...

Oh, and the FM tuner too, while your up. :-)

Both these answers are on the board already:

-WMA (and wav) support won't be available until the new codec plugin architecture appears on the player. I suspect this will be part of 1.1 rather than 1.01 (which is supposed to be a bug fix rather than new functionality), so it is likely to be a few weeks away yet.

-they have abandoned the FM-only tuner at the moment (couldn't find a module they were happy with), but they have found an FM/AM module that it acceptable. Hugo said that it will take at least 12 weeks to get production quantities of the tuner module from suppliers.

__
Unit serial number 47 (was 330 in the queue)...

Microsoft have just delayed our WMA licence as they're making some changes to the library at the moment. Hopefully this won't delay 1.1 - and if it does we may ship without WMA until the licence is approved.

As for the tuner, we'll obviously try hard to get some AM/FM modules more quickly from the grey market - fingers crossed.

Rob

How are you going to handle customer orders for the tuners, Rob? It sounds like you're going to have limited availability initially, which I imagine will cause a bit of a mad rush to get them by those of us who want radio. Will it be first-come-first-served or will you go by empeg serial number or customer number?

Just curious...

Oscar
(hungry for a tuner!)

The initial batch of tuners will more than cover the demand.

Rob

rob wrote:
> Microsoft have just delayed our WMA licence as they're making
> some changes to the library at the moment.

Does this mean that every empeg sale will (or already did)
further subsidise the evil empire? This is a dismal prospect.

Even more upsetting is the thought that if I upgrade to this
version, my previously unsullied empeg will contain and might
actually execute Microsoft-written code on a network-capable
device (at least, I assume it is currently unsullied---can
anyone reassure me on that?).

Does empeg get the source for this library or just a binary?
If just binary, as I suspect, it's a very alarming prospect
indeed and I'd like to request there be a WMA-free release for
those of us with a reasonable dose of paranoia and principles
to uphold!

I think it's already been mentioned that the codec mechanism
will be a plug-in architecture, so it should be possible to
just leave out the WMA bit and have it loaded separately.

--
http://ro.nu/ Robin O'Leary

Repeat to yourself, "it's just software".
You should really just relax.

___________
Tony Fabris

"It's just software, it's just software, it's just the richest man in the work shoving something I don't want down my throat."

Woops, got sidetracked. Actually I kind of agree. If this was a module I would not install it. It is a feature that I don't want that provides no benefit to me. I think it is great that it is there for those who want it, but for those of us with a little healthy paranoia it might be nice if it was an optional install.

-Mike

Just out of curiosity: what is the advantage to the WMA format? What's the justification for putting it high on the list of desirable features?

Thanks,
Oscar

ETA for WMA?

Ian / others
Can you explain why you're so anxious about WMA? I thought it is just a fancy rename of 'MS-Audio'. Am I missing something?


Henno
mk2 6 nr 6

for those of us with a little healthy paranoia it might be nice if it was an optional install.

"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you!"



tanstaafl.

"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"

Yes, every empeg sale will pay something to MS; however, every empeg sale also payes *more* to Thompson/Frauhofer, so I wouldn't get that worried. Apart from that, we pay MS rather a lot for all their MSDN stuff, VC++, etc etc - we do develop for the PC after all.

No, we just get binaries. We have to link with them though, so we're totally sure it does nothing apart from decoding audio data - there are no back doors in there.

The architecture is plug-in, but they're not separate files. The likelyhood of us doing a non-WMA capable release of 1.1 onwards is zero - it just adds time and hassle to the release process. Sorry!

As tfabris says, "relax, it's only software".

Hugo

WMA is very good for lower bitrates (eg, 64k WMA sounds much better than 64k MP3. The difference is less pronounced at higher rates).

Great for low-bitrate spoken word, etc. It also emphasises the fact that the empeg is an upgradeable multi-format player, and means MS will promote our player on their WMA website (we hope; if they don't, conspiracy theories involving the empeg running linux will emerge I'm sure).

Hugo

No, we just get binaries. We have to link with them though, so we're totally sure it does nothing apart from decoding audio data - there are no back doors in there.

*Snort* And we trap all its syscalls, right? Like socket(), for instance?

Peter

Ok, we don't, but it wasn't even designed to run on linux - it's designed to be embedded into a flash-based player. If it tried doing syscalls on these, it's likely to end up in trouble.

Ok, I'll make you happy and objdump it looking for swi's!

Hugo

Ok, I'll make you happy and objdump it looking for swi's!

I don't actually believe for a moment that Microsoft have inserted code that listens for DigitalConvergence audio signatures and emails them to DoubleClick, Visa, Amazon, Pizza Hut, and Metallica's lawyers -- but you can't tell the code's not there until you've looked for it...

Peter

Here's an idea. With the cuecat serial port adaptor you could hook it up to the empeg and have a printout of your play lists with barcodes. Your passenger scans it and it starts to play. Or they brought some cds and want to listen to them, instead they just scan the upc to see if the album is on there. Or you scan a can of Coke and it plays all pop songs.(Ok that was pretty bad. I think I need some help.)

-Finally received my Mark2 no thanks to customs.

Better yet -- get barcodes tattooed on all your potential passengers, and have automatic Wendy filtering...

Peter

Perhaps this would be a good application for voice recognition? The driver could say "Hi Wendy (or other name)" and activate the correct Wendy filter. Hm... This might actually work...

Paul G.
Q# 15189
Status: Finally cleared customs - 29 Sept 2000 (36GB Green)

>>ETA for WMA?
>Can you explain why you're so anxious about WMA? I thought >it is just a fancy rename of 'MS-Audio'. Am I missing >something?

In my admitedly subjective tests I have found that WMA when compared to MP3s encoded using Xing, Fraunhoffer or LAME comes out on top in the audio quality department. It encodes faster and sounds better, all IMHO of course. Right now I use 190 kbit MP3 on my EMPEG. I can get the same quality with 128kbit WMA, or even 96kbit in many cases. While the claims by MS that a 64kbit WMA stream sounds as good as a 128kbit MP3 is bogus, the codec does compress better.

I'd also like to stuff some audio books on the unit and MP3 completely blows for low bitrate spoken word. WMA does not.

All of this is of course my opinion.

And I don't care if there's MS code in my player. BFD, if their codec is the best (and so far it is) then that's the one I'll use as I refuse to use an inferior product just to make a statement.

You could put the tatoo on the back of their neck and integrate a scanner in the headrest.

-Finally received my Mark2 no thanks to customs.

The driver could say "Hi Wendy (or other name)" and activate the correct Wendy filter.

Oooh. That's actually a good idea.

I think that's one for the wishlist, Hugo.

-Zandr

-Zandr
Mk.I #150
Mk.II #39

As much as I hate to admit it (I'm no M$ fan), I did a very detailed comparison between MP3 (Xing encoder, 160k VBR) and WMA (96k), and I have to say I was very impressed. The WMA file was 50% smaller and I couldn't detect any real differences - even on my Seinnheiser HD600's fed with my external Tube headphone amp (a very revealing setup!). Converting from VBR MP3 to WMA was less successful - it sounded OK but the file ended up as 16+ minutes for some reason. Hmm.

Micro$oft's hegemony aside, it's a very cool format.