Ok, I was considering a new digital camera anyway but the /. article this morning got me a bit excited.

7dayshop.com has a special offer with them at £555.00 for the body only. This is cheap enough for me to not bother importing. edit: Link not working now - possibly a mistake or sold out. Would be interested in cheap EU/US camera shops that export.

Just wondering what others think of the camera in light of the new hidden functions?

Gareth

Bit of an update. I've been browsing eBay and there are lots of options - a couple of well-rated Hong Kong sellers, the cheapest being £628 for body+lens+256mb card, plus £30 shipping "no duty guaranteed".
Another interesting one "carmansphotosource" which has a body+2 lenses+2 batteries+256mb card for $AU1500 (£608), much less than a lesser pack targetted to UK buyers! I've send a msg as if I didn't know they have UK sales (on another ebay ID, 3k+ feedback) to see if they are willing to do a deal. All have shedloads of feedback (3k+) so I don't expect to get screwed.

Gareth

All have shedloads of feedback (3k+) so I don't expect to get screwed.

A mate of mine got screwed on ebay by someone with loads of feedback. Turned out it was a hacked account.

A mate of mine got screwed on ebay by someone with loads of feedback. Turned out it was a hacked account.

Nah, these seem ok - the Canada one takes cards directly as well as PayPal, and they seem to be camera-type shops.

The hacked accounts are usually obvious if you know the scam - the seller has been selling beany babies for ages and then suddenly lists projectors and plasmas with payment to Ukraine by Western Union. Every now and then I do a search for "plasma" and report the inevitable dozen or so hacked accounts. There is another dozen or so listings by people with zero feedback - this is almost certainly an account created with a stolen card but it is impossible for a user to report such an account. eBay could easily stop this by forcing people to confirm their card in the same way that PayPal does.

Gareth

Just wondering what others think of the camera in light of the new hidden functions?

The original D-Rebel/300D was a non-starter for me specifically as a result of the way they dumbed down the camera. If you can't adjust flash output, for example, you'll have no way of getting good pictures if/when your automatic flash exposure doesn't come out quite right (which, unfortunately, happens more often than you'd prefer).

The hacked D-Rebel/300D is something I would have considered more seriously against the Nikon D70. It's interesting to compare the approaches of both manufacturers. Canon dumbed down and cost reduced the 10D to create the D-Rebel. Nikon built the D70 that is, in many respects, better than the more expensive D100. A very interesting question is whether Canon would have done (or might still do) the hack themselves given the market pressures from their competition.

Another interesting question you might ask is whether to buy a Nikon D70 or a hacked Canon D-Rebel/300D. Assuming you don't already have an investment in lenses from either manufacturer and you're not planning to buy thousands of dollars of lenses in the immediate future, the real question is the Canon kit vs. the Nikon kit. At $999 vs. $1299, the extra $300 for the Nikon may well be the deciding factor for most people. There are many reasons why the Nikon kit is superior to the Canon kit, with or without the hacks, but budget often trumps features, and the extra Canon features with the hacked firmware probably won't change many buying decisions for consumers stepping up from point-and-shoots. On the other hand, there may be a noticable shift for people with a big Canon investment already who are looking for a secondary camera body. If somebody like Andy, with all his existing kit, wanted a backup body for any of a variety of reasons, the hacked D-Rebel/300D may be appealing to him in a way that it wasn't beforehand.

I think I have found a decent kit at a good price - Carman's Photo has a kit just over $1,000: You get the body, two Sigma lenses (listed on a UK site for £200 each), two hi-cap batteries, 256mb card, chargers, a LowePro case some filters and a whole load of other bits.

I have just blown a few hundred on a used laptop and have a car coming into port in a week so I'm going to keep thinking and reading until I know how much that's going to finally cost me!

Anyway, I spotted this photo on the dpreview forums and thought it was excellent:

http://www.members.shaw.ca/ranplett/gifs/baby_grasshopper.jpg

Apparently used a 55mm Canon lens, 1.4x teleconverter and 69mm of extension tubes.

Gareth

Regardless of which camera you get, be sure to get the fastest CF card you can, you'll get better overall performance.

-Zeke

Those two lenses are most likely the Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC and 55-200mm f/4-5.6 DC. B&H Photo lists the pair for $239 and the D-Rebel body for $829, so if you've found the same kit for $1000, you're getting a good but still believable deal. The only real trade-off is that these lenses won't work on 35mm film cameras because the image circle is smaller. The same trade-off applies to the 18-55mm kit lens that you can also get along with the Canon D-Rebel body.

If you wanted, you could get the exact same Sigma lenses for the same price for a Nikon body. A Nikon D70 without lens is $1000. You might consider whether the extra $170 for the Nikon solution is preferable to the Canon solution or not.

Another interesting point: the Sigma 55-200mm is an intriguing lens, regardless of whether you go Canon or Nikon. The Sigma is only 11oz heavy (310g) and 3.3" long (85mm). The comparable Canon EF 55-200mm f/4.5-5.6 USM II Autofocus is 10.9oz / 3.8" long for $200 by itself. The closest Nikon seems to be the AF Zoom Nikkor 70-300mm f/4-5.6G. That's only $100, but it's 4.6" long and ~17oz.

None of these lenses are what you might call "pro-quality", but the lighter weight and smaller size makes them more attractive if you need to haul them around.

Regardless of which camera you get, be sure to get the fastest CF card you can, you'll get better overall performance.

This will make a big difference on the Canon D-Rebel, since it has a relatively small image buffer. It's less necessary for the Nikon D70. I have two cards, a "16x" Lexar 1GB and a Sandisk "Extreme" 1GB. The Sandisk is supposed to be one of the fastest you can buy, while the Lexar is an older generation card. Honestly, shooting with either card, I've never noticed a difference, and I've gotten into the press photographer style of shooting several shots in rapid succession to make sure at least one comes out right. The D70's buffering is good enough to hide the slower throughput of my Lexar card.

When in doubt, check out Rob Galbraith's database. He measures the throughput of every different card against every different camera and discusses whether you need faster cards or not.

True, the buffer will mask the write perfomance but you'll notice if you fill the buffers and have to wait for them to clear, especially if you're shooting RAW mode. High speed flash cards also make for much quicker picture playback IMO. I've go the 10D with the 1GB Sandisk Extreme II. Using that card in my older Canon S30 turns it into an entirely different camera. I bought it after revieiwing the site you linked to; that's a great resource.

-Zeke

I'm considering getting a d-rebel as well and I'm confused on the lens issue. Is there a downside to getting that Sigma lens pack vs the rebel kit (and a second lens at a later date when I can afford it)? Or to phrase it another way, how does sigma's 18-50 compare to the rebel kit's 18-55?

-Mike

Or to phrase it another way, how does sigma's 18-50 compare to the rebel kit's 18-55?

A better place to ask this question is probably the Canon SLR Lens forum over at dpreview:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/forum.asp?forum=1029

Taking a quick look it appears that the general concensus is that the two are optically comparable, but the Sigma has a noisy focus motor.

It's certainly cheaper to get the Canon kit lens, if that's all you want. If you also really want the longer lens, then the Sigma kit may be cheaper. But it's not just about cost. When you get into the longer lenses, you start needing to ask yourself whether you want image stabilization and wider apertures (big $$$, heavy lenses) or whether you're concerned more about travel weight.

I'm currently sitting on the fence about a longer lens because I haven't found a reason that I might actually need to use one. Since the long lens I'd really like (the Nikon 70-200 VR) is $1500 and is both large and heavy, I'm in no hurry to buy it. My next lens purchase is more likely to be a 50mm f/1.4 prime or maybe one of the ultra wideangle options (Nikon 12-24 DX or the 10.5 DX fisheye).

But it's not just about cost.

You know, thats a good point. I haven't done any serious photography in 10 years so I should probably just get the kit lens and get used to the camera before I decide on any extra purchases. Damn voice of reason

-Mike

Given that the Canon kit lens is only available as part of the kit I suspect that if you decide to sell it in 12 months time you might end up not losing much money on it at all.

Well, I ended up passing on the d-rebel. I played with on for a bit at a store and it just didn't feel right. It is a little small for my hands and I wasn't happy with the apparent build quality of the body or the kit lens. I was tempted by the 10d, but ultimately couldn't justify the extra cost. I split the difference and ended up going with the nikon d70 instead. Better quality, better features, and a better feel than the d-rebel. It doesn't quite have the solid feel of the 10d (or nikon's more upscale SLRs), but I think it will be a good camera for me. Plus I'm a little more familiar with nikons from the old f-body I used to have. Anyway, I ordered one today from B&H and I'll hopefully get it in a couple days.

-Mike

Congrats on your soon-to-arrive new toy. I'm sure you'll enjoy it immensely (I still love my 10D dearly months later - kind of like the empeg).

Has anyone else here other than myself got a Hi-Ti dye sub printer? Mine arrived Friday and I'm blown away by its prints, especially for the sub-$400 price.

-Zeke

Congrats on your soon-to-arrive new toy.

Thanks, I've been having a blast with it the last couple days! Here are a couple of pics if anyone is interested...

Scenic weeds
Brisbane clouds

-Mike

Nice shots. Gotta love 'golden hour' light of the late afternoon. Was the sky shot a stitch or a crop?

I just ordered my first piece of Canon L-glass last night 28-70 f2.8 USM. I can't wait.

-Zeke

Nice shots. Gotta love 'golden hour' light of the late afternoon. Was the sky shot a stitch or a crop?

Thanks! The sky shot is a crop to get rid off a lot of murky brown water and a little boring sky Congrats on the L-glass, that should be a great lens.

-Mike

Yeah, I'd hate to add up all the hours spent reading dpreview.com lens forums trying to find the general consensus on lenses. The only one I could come up with is that _everyone_ thinks the lenses they have are the best choice (an obvious conclusion, now that I think about it).

Great forums there, if you haven't visited them. Lots & lots of traffic with some really good input.

I have to say that I agree with you about the feel of the Rebel. My friend has one and I got a chance to use his when I visited him a few weeks back. Even compared to my old A2E film back, which is plastic, it felt really small & inconsequential. I know the sensor's the same, but I'd be worried taking it about, I often take mine on hikes. He'd already worn the silver surface off near the grip due to about a month's heavy use (~2k photos) in India.

-Zeke

Great forums there, if you haven't visited them. Lots & lots of traffic with some really good input.

Yeah, I spent quite a bit of time reading over their before I bought my camera. The D70 forum is actually a bit too busy for my tastes. Unless its a really hot topic everything falls off the front page within an hour.

Say, has anyone here ever considered doing a photo a day project (a la www.photoaday.net)? I was considering it as it seems like it would be a great way to get familiar with my new camera as well as getting back into photography in general. I'd like to find some decent web gallery software meant for that type of a project (sort of a cross between gallery software and blogging software). Most people seem to just use pbase.com, but I'd rather having something running on my own server. Anyway, if anybody has any suggestions I'd appreciate them.

-Mike

Gallery allows comments, but I'm not sure if that's what you're looking for.

Gallery allows comments, but I'm not sure if that's what you're looking for.

Yeah, I was thinking of something a little different, although I may end up hacking up Gallery (or IDS which I currently use). I'd like something that is meant to work chronologically. Maybe with a calendar like interface to allow you to go back in time, but with the main page (or top of the main page) always being todays photo and comments.

-Mike

Say, has anyone here ever considered doing a photo a day project

Rob Vreeland (the guy who made the wooden fascias and used to hang around here a lot, started doing the photo a day thing a while back. He was doing good until we went to a kitebuggy event in the desert and he started getting busy doing sports photos. His D2H is getting a waterproof houseing made for it right now for kitesurfing and wave surfing shooting.

http://www.pbase.com/robv

Rob Vreeland (the guy who made the wooden fascias and used to hang around here a lot, started doing the photo a day thing a while back

Yeah, I remember Rob. He has some pretty creative pics in his pbase galleries. Some of his kite surfing photos are awesome (like this one). I was actually planning on trying for some similar shots this weekend along the SF Bay trail out near Coyote Point. There always seems to be kiters (is that a word?) in that area.

-Mike

Haha... funny you should pick that one out. I had him print me out an 11" poster of that shot. That's where he and i kiteboard... 3rd Ave just south of Coyote Point. We should meet up there sometime! If the winds nice i will probably be out there tomorrow. We park at the South end of the driving range... look for my black WRX or Rob's Land Rover Discovery with a lift kit.

Thats crazy, yeah that is exactly the area I was thinking of. I go for bike rides through there about every other weekend, I'll look for you guys if I make it out there tomorrow.

Incidentally I went ahead and signed up for a pbase gallery to do photo a day. I've added a link to it in my sig here and a couple other places to encourage people to critique my stuff (and hopefully harass me if I skip a day).

-Mike