This week, after reading about the passport software cr*p that Microsoft has implemented into their new Windows XP OS, I finally had it. I thought that this whole Microsoft business, though already a thorn in my side for a long time had finally gone too far.
I decided to no longer howl with the wolves in the forest and to bite the bullet : I'm gonna get me some Linux!
But I don't know the first thing about it. Which one should I get? Redhat, Suse or Mandrake? Which one is best for a beginner?

I'm craving to get back to times when I could tell my PC what to do (like in the DOS days), instead of it dictating me! (which is now the case).
I realise Linux is no walk in the park. I do know that it will take me several months if not years to learn how to use it at it's fullest potential. But I don't care. I want to.
Now, I'm not a total GUI point 'n click nut. I did work for more than five years with dos, so text-based OSes are not entirely new to me. I can say, in all modesty, that in those days I knew my OS practically to the bone. I knew how it worked, and I understood the way it thought. This is something I gave up on in windows a long time ago.
So don't tell me it's going to take me some time to learn, I know that. But I also know that once I get the hang of it, I will be able to do most things ten times faster than somebody who's using windows.
But please point me in the right direction. Which Linux distribution is best for a beginner?

ps. I also want to do this because I want to understand better the way the Empeg works.

Well, you willlikely get many answers to this and an equal amount of people trying to convince you to take such or so. Me personally I am quite happy with Red Hat, though they sometimes make some odd decissions. Still, in the end it's all the same OS and kernel underneath. For me adding and changing stuff is usually not to much of an issue so I just go with Red Hat partly because they seem to be pretty stable business wise. Suse for instance has been having some financial troubles lately which don't mean they have a bad distro but is still a little worrying. Debian of course is also an all time favorite. Perhaps even the best choice if you want to lean towards the empeg more.

My suggestion is get a few CDs with a combo of various distros (the sell all over the place) and play around with them yourself. You will quickly find your own favorite and as I said in the end it is all linux.

Cheers,
Hans


Mk2 - Blue & Red - 080000431

I agree with Hans in many respects. I too have been mainly a "path of least resistance" Red Hat user for some of the reasons he describes, although I have bought/installed SuSE, Slackware, others over the past few years, and I don't consider my Red Hat choice binding (Hey, RH, where's that KOffice 1.1 RPM!?!). I'm starting to learn a bit more about Debian.

I would also recommend getting 2-3 recent distributions and installing each to kick the tires. The various Linux installs have gotten so much better over the past couple of years that you can manage a full install on a moderately speedy machine (with attention to CD speed) in 45 minutes or so. Try to get most recent distros so you are comparing apples to apples. If you are looking to perhaps shelter yourself for a while from the process of compiling source code to add applications, then take a look at the distro's system for adding pre-built applications (RPM, app-get) as well.

One thing I would advise is that, regardless of what distro you ultimately decide to work with, you might want to "over-install" a bit. Assuming you've got a big, cheap hard drive, adding components such as "development tools" (languages, compilers, libraries) early on on a blanket basis means that you won't have to go back and add them one by one when the day comes that you do want to compile a particular oddball app.

Agree: a turn for the worse with XP. I don't understand what reason a thoughtful CTO/CIO in a Windows 2000 shop could find for upgrading especially given the licensing changes. Problem is, in 1-2 years, that CTO won't be able to buy a copy of Windows 2000 and it will be XP -- take it or.... Yes, it's an especially good juncture to be looking at Linux.

Lastly, if I can recommend a piece of reading it would be a sub to Linux Journal (published a few blocks away from here). It's sometimes an odd mix of articles, but I think it does a really excellent job of giving folks like me a good sense of what's going on out there -- what's possible with Linux. Great recent security articles. Hey, about 20 percent of it flies over my head, but that's OK. I get the drift!

Jim

I agree with the others, you will probably get many different answers on this, but here is my personal opponion:

If you want a good workstation distro with some nice configuration tools, go with the newer Mandrake builds.

If you want to avoid downloading as much as possible, get SuSE (It's 7 CD's or 1 DVD now). There is usually only one or two things I download after installing SuSE, since so much is in it. Financially SuSE is not doing really well, but they have grabbed enough interest that companies like IBM will not let them fall.

But since everyones opponions are different, I also recommend trying out as many as possible. I used my broadband connection a few years back to just download the FTP install disks, then let it run to install so many different distros. It also gave me a nice insight into each one, and finally I settled with SuSE. (Mainly because of Yast at that early stage was much better then where the other distros were for configuration).

Yeah, asking which distro is the best is kinda like asking what color is the best. It's all based on personal preferences, what I like isn't necessarily what others like (and I KNOW what I like goes gainst the grain). Best thing you can do is try out several and see what YOU like.

Personally, my favorite is Slackware. I've tried the others, but always went back... If you want to know my reasons, I can write a disertation on the various distros, likes and dislikes about them, as well as other happenings (like the LSB)

Another side of this question: which book would you recommend to a Linux beginner? I'm asked this sometimes and have no idea what to answer, having learned most things from man pages and the like...

Borislav

If you have a fast internet connection, my recomdation would be to get the latest copy of the Debian distribution. Why? The apt-get utilities on debian are top-notch and make upgrading as simple as typing apt-get update apt-get upgrade (it'll download/install latest patches/etc automatically for you.. only requirement, have a decent internet connection because those patches can add up to 20-30mb's...)

It's a very clean distribution that really puts Redhat to shames.. check it out.
-mark
PS - forgot to install tool xyz? No problem - apt-get install xyc and you're done!
...Still (barely, pending 1.1 release) proud to have owned an Empeg since 00287

Wow...I had no idea that many people would respond.

Thanks All!

If there's anything I've learned now it's : you figure it out, it's all about personal preference. OK, I will.
I'm surprised though that so little of you actualy promote Redhat, though I believe it's the most common distro.

Borislav also makes a good point. Anyone know of any good books for beginners?

Oh, and Dionysus, I'm on ADSL (and soon cable), so a fast connection is no problem. I have to admit that I've never heard of that Debian Distribution

Again, thanks all for your replies!

not to distract you from a pure debian install, you might want to check out progeny, it's a commercial debian varient headed by Ian Mudock. I've been running it on my laptop, and it has been really stable.

I know how you feel about the whole windows thing.. I've been doing linux systems for years, and it's just been silly how bad it's gotten. after you get used to thinking like a unix user, things will just feel warm and fuzzy all over :)

oh.. btw.. http://www.progeny.com is where you want to go :)

12gig red mk2 -- 080000125

Well, promote RedHat ... I used to, not that they have let me down since or something but there is so much to be had out there that it is neigh impossible to keep up with all of it so ... And personal preference is an important factor too.

As to the Windows thing. I am thoroughly disgusted that we (the IT community in general) have let it come to this. I don't mind that Microsoft or any other company for that matter make money, hell they are supposed to, but what really disgusts my is the suffocating influence they exert or try to exert on anything that is not theirs. The manner in which this is done is simply repulsive. Examples being their attempts to discredit Open Source, the way they bribe hardware vendors to supply customers only with their OS, the way they continue to squeeze more money out of their customers constantly while in return customers get less and less rights on the dollar, the way they then justify these ever growing restrictions on what you are allowed to do with your investments in their OS on the account of them loosing millions per year on piracy when in reality the company keeps getting richer and richer and richer.

Oh and don't you even dare standing up for your rights (cfr. Sun and the JVM issue) or we will boycot you (effectivly signing your death warrant).

Not to mention how they continuously run loops around local and international law. What do you mean we can't just barge in everywhere (on private property) with our Microsoft License Police because of something as trivial as laws ? Okay in that case we will add a clause to our volume license key owners (the only ones that are profitable enough to police anyways because of the number of machine) EULA stating that accepting a volume license key means you also will allow us to come audit you at any time we see fit. There, trivial law problem solved.

I think I better stop now before I get an ulcer.

Cheers,
Hans


Mk2 - Blue & Red - 080000431

My usual recommendation for a Linux Distribution is based on who you know that uses Linux...

If you know someone who uses a particular distro then start with that one... you will get more help that way from a close source... I think most people I know who use Linux started on one distro but moved to others once they became comfortable with it...

If you are starting completely on your own, then I would throw a vote in for a recent Mandrake (though I haven't used it for a while now)... At some point I would definitely give Debian (or a derivative) a try... it is now my favorite due to the ease of upgrade and system setup... :) but it is a little harder to start with than some of the other distros for a newbie... Better to come to it later on when you have got a feel for what you are after from your Linux box...

Hope that helps

Kim

Hans : Yup, that exactly how I feel about it too. There's nothing wrong with a company making money, but it has to be in an honest way.
I hate monopoly's, nothing good can come out of them. And put it any way you like it : Microsoft IS a quasi monopoly for desktop pc's. (anybody ever tried to get a different OS installed when they buy a new computer? Good luck!).

OTOH, everybody is whining about Microsoft, but it's mainly because of US, the comsumers, that they are still where they are. Because we KEEP on buying their stuff and accept (willingly or not) their every whim.
Well, not me anymore. I've had it. I'm trying something new (for me anyway) now.

Kimbotha : I don't have any friends that are already using Linux. In fact, some said to me : "I'll let you struggle with it for a while and once you get the hang of it, I'll try it too." .
I can't really blame them, somebody had to be the fist. Too bad it's me.

Oh well, I think I'll go to the shops later on this week and have a look at the different distros available. I'll make my choice then.

Thanks all for your help.

Oh well, I think I'll go to the shops later on this week

Nah. Check out http://www.lsl.com/ -- they do an 11 CD set with 4 of the major distros on. You can just try them all. It only costs $18.

Admittedly, you don't get manuals with that, but you do get a whole heap of HOWTOs and stuff, all of which are available on the net -- try http://www.linuxdoc.org/


Roger - not necessarily speaking for empeg

they do an 11 CD set with 4 of the major distros on. You can just try them all. It only costs $18.

Wow! I don't think I can go wrong on that deal Roger!

Thanks!